How to critically look at a Blog's real value.
Many of my readers also read Blogger Unleashed and probably already know that Vic has kicked up a firestorm over the recent purchase of One Man's Goal by a beginner blogger for the price of $10,500. I won't rehash that story here but for those who aren't familiar with the controversy you can catch up by following the link trail below - I want to talk about another Blog for sale - John Cow dot Com.
Read Vic's post and watch the Video here; Blogger Unleashed
Read One Man's Goal comments and Video here; One Man's Goal
Read Don's post at Making Sales Making Money
And Justin's post at Blogging Zombie
I found this interesting as I was planning on writing about this subject a couple of days ago when I found out that John Cow was up for sale. You can see the Cow's post here; Cow for Sale and the prequel post done prior to the announcement here; How Much is our Blog Worth
To summarize the fellow behind the "Cow" persona is moving to Oz from Europe and won't be able to continue the Blog. He figures it's worth $25,000 - $50,000 and lists his reasons why in the latter article.
Do I have a beef with this blog? Nope. It was a clever parody of John Chow that gave the owner some quick fame in the MMO niche. Is it really a MMO blog. Nope. It is much like the rest of the blogs that claim to be "make money online" blogs - it is a social blog that makes money selling ads and promoting affiliate sign ups and basically has a readership base but no organic traffic. It doesn't teach others how to "make money" which is what I call a "real" make money online blog. It makes money for the owner and not for the reader. In other words a typical "John Chow" spin off site but with a talented writer behind it for a change.
Where I do have a problem is that someone will likely pay $25,000 or more for this blog and it is not worth a fraction of that price. This isn't a slam against the owner, just an objective look at the numbers.
First off - the blog is a social site with 1658 readers who subscribe based on one thing - an affinity for the owner. Basically the readers like the guy and enjoy his writing. They will not necessarily like the new buyer and will likely never return upon the sale. Remember Cash Quests? This blog sold a while back after rising quickly in the social arena based on the talents of it's creator - Kumiko? I forget. Like the Cow it was good at link baiting and getting attention. Cash Quests sold for $15,000 and then promptly nosedived as the new owners (a blog network) proceeded to post the most useless keyword stuffed generic rehashed crap imaginable.
Look at Cash Quests Alexa Ranking below.
Click on all images to enlarge
That shows what happened to the RSS subscribers - they jumped ship. As for search engine traffic it has none. It's keywords don't rank anywhere in the serp's front pages. The site has no visitors now and if you doubt me - check the comments out. There are no comments. Is it worth $15,000? It will never make that investment back under it's current operator.
The Cow lists a number of "assets" that he believes makes his site a valuable commodity. This includes things like;
He Claims to make $2,500 per month. How this is made is not specified but if true it must be from selling ad space and flogging affiliate sign ups to things like TLA. There is no Adsense income.
He Claims 30,000 uniques a month for traffic. He believes that this equates to having to spend $144,000 a year on Adwords to get the equivalent amount of traffic.
He boasts of having a 5th spot Google ranking for the term "Making Money Online" and a #1 ranking for the term "John Chow". He mentions that it would be hard to put a sum on this but you would have to pay a lot for a text link campaign to get these rankings.
He mentions that the blog has 382 posts and content like that would cost almost 6k if paying someone $15 per post to write it. There are 2,830 pages indexed by Google.
He has 1659 RSS sbscribers and mentions that Mark at 45n5 estimates that each RSS subscriber is worth $30. This makes his blog worth $49,770.
He also mentions that he has a professional theme and header worth another $2500.
He will introduce the new owner to John Chow.
In the end he mentions that the blog could be worth up to $344,000 but realistically notes that no one would pay that amount. His point is that the blog s likely worth more than the 10-12 times monthly earnings which puts it in the $25k or more category.
Now for some critical thinking.
The current earnings if true are based on the RSS feed numbers. He sells ads and promotes stuff to his readers. If the new owner loses those subscribers then the advertising sales stop as well as the affiliate signups. What do you think is likely to happen? People don't learn how to make money online on the site - they are there to be entertained by the Cow. Unless the new owner has the same ability then say good bye to the readers. (If such a person was out there they probably already have a popular site - who knows maybe it's worth the money to someone already established and known but the chance of an unknown keeping the readers is slim.)
Take away the RSS readers and the income stops. Without the income the blog is worthless.
He has almost no organic traffic - yes he has 2800 pages indexed but they aren't on page 1 for anything. No search traffic.
The two terms he ranks for; "Making Money Online" and "John Chow".
What are these terms worth?
As it happens there are only two people in the world that knows as much as me regarding "Making Money Online."
The Cow actually ranks 4th on Google not 5th and guess who ranks 3rd for that term?
Would you like to know how much traffic that term generates?
Not as much as you might think.
Here are the last 80 keywords people used to find my blog. Take a look and notice how many times "Making Money Online" shows up in comparison to the other make money online keywords. 



I had 4 searches out of 80 and I'm in 3rd spot. I used to be in 4th spot. I get 4 times as many hits now as I did in 4th spot. I have mentioned not to put too much stock in the actual numbers given out by keyword tools. The list below is keyword Elites list of the most searched keywords related to "Make Money Online". The term "making money online" appears to be the 3rd most searched term.
But is it? Here is my Statcounter stats showing the percentage of what keywords people use to find my blog for the same period as the screenshots above.
This is not very scientific and only gives a brief shot in time compared to my entire days stats but the ratios don't change that much over a 24 hour period. The fact is the term "making money online" is my second highest ranking "main" MMO keyword and yet my 4th ranking term "How to make money" pulls in a lot more visitors everyday than it does. Yet the keyword tools don't show many searches for the term at all.
John Cow won't get more than 20 visitors a day for his 4th place ranking.
As for the term "John Chow" I see keyword elite shows 179 searches for that term last month. Again it may be incorrect in actual numbers but there won't be much traffic gained because the Cow ranks number 1 for it. Maybe 2-3 visitors a day.
Btw - the Cow mentioned that it would cost a hefty sum to get this kind of ranking using Text Link Ads. It probably would although it didn't cost me diddly to get a better ranking. Of course I don't use Text Link Ads nor recommend anyone else using them. Then again I only dominate all the MMO keywords in the rankings but what do I know - I don't have 1600 RSS subscribers.
SEO doesn't have to cost a lot if you know what you are doing.
As for Mark's evaluation that RSS subscribers are worth $30 each I guess this is what this post is really all about. I have nothing against John Cow - I'm just trying to stop the insanity that has spread through the blogging world. RSS subscribers aren't worth shit - really. It's false hype and here is why. The top A-list subscribers are worth a lot because the A-List can make money from them. They get paid to promote crap to their readers because they have huge numbers. No one will pay you to promote anything to your 100 or 1000 subscribers. By the time you start promoting TLA with an affiliate link the market has been saturated by the A-list. TLA has already paid John Chow to sign you up and 10,000 others like you. Who are you going to sign up? Your readers have already joined. There is nothing that you can sell that your readers haven't already seen and done. Your RSS subscribers aren't worth a dime unless you can actually come up with something new and if you do you will just pay John Chow to flog it anyway.
This post isn't aimed at people trying to sell their blog - it's aimed at the people thinking of buying one.
There is only one stat that can make a site valuable. Search traffic. Why? Because it is independent of the former owners personality and you can see concrete proof of earnings that won't change the minute you purchase the site.
For example. If I was to sell this blog I could guarantee two things; my readers won't likely be back and tomorrow you will make $100 with Adsense. And the day after... and next week and so on.
Oh you won't have to post everyday or every week either. Your income will not be derived from keeping readers happy and returning. Remember to keep advertisers paying you have to keep readers coming in daily. I can keep my serp rankings for months without ever posting an article.
If you ever decide to buy a blog ask to look at the search stats and the Adsense revenue. If they have no Adsense revenue then they have no serp rankings for any decent keywords. If they have no serp rankings for decent keywords then the blog isn't worth a dime - yes this includes the A-List because a new owner will lose the readers and be left with nothing.
If the Cow is worth $25,000 based on 1600 readers and $2500 in ad revenue a month what would my little blog network be worth...
And that's just Adsense.
Think about what would make a better return on your investment. Which would you rather buy? Oh that's right - some people want to be famous rather than make money - silly me.
The thing you should really think about is this - if anyone is really making decent money for the time invested in their blog they won't be selling. Why would I ever sell? I post when I want. I write about what I want. None of it effects my income in the slightest. My traffic comes in everyday whether I am here or not. Yes some of my readers get on me about writing another post but they don't have any effect on my income. They just make all this fun.
The Cow says moving to Oz is the reason for selling. Maybe. I travel a lot and have no problem logging in and maintaining my sites though. I'm not saying he is being dishonest but I have noticed a trend happening lately. The A-List and A-list clone sites aren't doing so well in the stats lately.
Check these Alexa rankings out - could people be getting tired of all the crap these sites have been spewing? Could the fact that a certain blogger, who has shown up recently calling all the A-listers out, be having an effect on how people are beginning to view the MMO niche. Just thinking out loud...
John Cow Traffic
John Chow Traffic
Darren Rowse (Problogger) Traffic
Shoemoney Traffic
Is it a coincidence that all these sites are heading south at the same time as the following site showed up on the radar?
Just speculating. Bloggers never had a choice of opinions or methods prior to Vic. It was the same old same old. Maybe the winds of change are coming and probably not a bad time for some of the old guard to start selling when the selling is good. Just don't be one of the buyers...
Griz
Saturday, April 12, 2008
What is a Blog Really Worth?
Project Payday - A Legit Method to Make Money at Home
I have included Project Payday on my blog for all of my readers who write in asking if there are any legit online programs that they can use to make some quick money. Project Payday is not a get rich quick scheme - it is more like a work at home job. You don't need a blog or website as it involves getting paid to try out trial offers from online advertisers. There is work to this but you can realistically earn a couple of hundred dollars a day if you want to put in the effort.
I have written several posts about this and suggest you start with this one. Project Payday
Unfortunately Project Payday is only available to American users at this time. Their sister program is still available to users in the US, Canada, UK and Australia. (free to join as well) Affiliate Income Partners
CashCrate is another similar program (you get paid to take trial offers for products, services or completing online surveys etc.) Cashcrate does accept people world wide and they have a decent selection for Canadian and UK residents. If you are American then you will benefit the most as you have the most offers to choose from. Btw - it's free to join.
For comparative purposes the stats below reflect my actual earnings with Cashcrate.
A Little Heart to Heart
You have probably figured out by now that you aren't going to find the answer in a $47 ebook or by following your favorite twit on twitter. The fact is many of you are still wondering how this plain free hosted Blogger blog dominates the rankings on the search engines - right? Did you find this site by typing in "make money online" in Google?
If you did then you are halfway to learning the secret to making money online - you need targeted traffic from the search engines (for any niche you pick) and once you have that, you can sell them what they are looking for. Sounds simple and on paper it is - actually dominating the search engines is the hard part. It takes time and you do need to understand keywords and anchor text links. You can spend time on this site and sift through my posts to learn this or you can do yourself a favor and pony up one buck and test drive Court's Keyword Academy Crash Course for a month and learn just why I rank number 1 in the search engines.
This isn't another waste of money or time - just an honest answer for the few of you willing to do the work and who really do want to make a long term sustainable living online. Read my blog from back to front or try a more focused approach with Court - either way you will not be disappointed.
Cheers
Griz
How to Contact Me
If you need help with anything discussed in these pages don't be afraid to email me with your questions. I won't spam you and I will answer you directly or in a future post. I will never share your email.Period.
You can send your questions to Grizzly
Update - March 2009
Please note that I am getting more email than I can keep up with so if you need an answer fast please use the comments section. You will receive an answer by me or one of my readers in short order. Thanks. Griz
Contact Grizzly if you would like to advertise on this blog.
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187 comments:
That was fast!
Your second not third.
I think its really cool how you can just easily rise in the search engines. And your so laid back about it.
Soon I will have the knowledge base and skills to do that.
It will take a while but I have enough,.....Im only 16.
failureblogger-16 year old blogger.
Failure,
Stick with me kid - you'll never be famous but you might make a few bucks. lol.
ooops sorry!
5th
I like the graphic trend of other bloggers you put together at the end. The big drop in Vic's blog is when he did no post because he was hacked.
This morning, I asked questions to something similar(not Cow but Onemansgold.com) but did not go as far as you. ;)
I do agree, look at where the revenue come from and think more SEO.
Failure,
You will get different rankings depending on what data center you're in.
"This post isn't aimed at people trying to sell their blog - it's aimed at the people thinking of buying one"
Grizz, this is a signifiacnt post in todays market, thaks for cluing some inot the nuts and bolts of site value, thanks for the mention
Don
I'll have to print this out and tape it to the wall...
"Then again I only dominate all the MMO keywords in the rankings but what do I know - I don't have 1600 RSS subscribers."
Classic!
griz,
i heard google is now flagging, for human review, sites with dashes in the domain name. seen/heard anything on that? fairly new i believe, supposedly in google reviewers guidelines. heard it from a paid membership site i am on.
Great post Griz! Any news on your LV and BLS comparison?
Tiger's making his move at the Master's. NEVER count him out!
freakin' hilarious. i wish i had this post before i bought one of my sites. i learned the hardway about lack of search traffic = lack of money. i paid 250$ for it, not 25000$, but still stings. now i've gotta work my way up the search engines with it and try to sell it off. luckily it's got a pr 3 and tons of links for one keyword (which unfortunately just doesn't get searched much). i'm trying to move up with others. findatheater.net is the site...just in case you have other suggestions (i kno there's only 1 post - it used to be a search only site that i turned into a blog ).
-Jack
Wow Grizz shoot thanks man I sure hope that in some way folks are seeing it different god knows we cry it to the winds. I look forward to this crowd of new real money makers flourish and start also crying to the winds that indeed their is a real way of doing this and that it is not the way that it has been told by the so called "A Listers" for ages.
mmmm dude btw look at my new post it should be up like in 30 minutes LMAO!!!
I think Cow is bored with his blog and wants to bail. He didn't post himself for a while a few months ago and used guest bloggers. That was probably part of the Alexa drop you noted and a good cautionary tale to a potential buyer.
I do think there are a lot of disillusioned folks out there. Many have just given up. You'll find many dead MMO blogs out there in the lower reaches of the 45n5 list.
Wooow! Huge post man!
Congrats for being number 3 for:
"make money online"
Totally off topic ... but check this out. i started this blog when you started your seo contest kristy-lee-cook-fan.blogspot.com (i know...it's not about epperson..more of like a parallel experiment). anway....google "christy lee cook bio" and check out who's #1! :)
unfortunately, i'm not ranking that well for her name spelled correctly. but i've only got 4 articles and three links to the site.....
just wanted to say thx Grizz! :)
Steve,
I could have posted more graphs that had the same trend - 45n5, Yaro and Andy Beard show the same downward trend. They all feel it has something to do with Alexa changing it's program but I'm not sure. I know of several sites moving up steadily through this same time period.
I read your post Steve and you are right - in the long run SEO is still the way to build a lasting income online.
Don,
You are welcome and good post btw.
I can't speak for others but I know what I'm looking for when I evaluate a site on the net. The only consistent variable is search traffic and it doesn't change no matter how many new owners take over. Every other yardstick is a crap shoot and can't be trusted. Some people like to gamble - I don't.
Thom,
You liked that did you? Lol.
I have to laugh - bloggers seem to think that someone with a high RSS feed count must know what they are doing and that they make money. Not true as evidenced by Caroline Middlebrook.
I have been saying this for ages - the people making real money online aren't famous - they are just quietly dominating all the heavily trafficked keywords and making a really good living.
You have probably noticed I have done all the work and don't have to do much anymore with this blog or any of my other niches for that matter. The money keeps coming in whether I work or not.
The social sites have to constantly produce new posts and that is why they have turned to crap. Why does Chow post pictures of his dinner? What else can he come up with? Being famous is a lot of work and he knows his living is threatened the moment he lets up. His money dries up the moment his readers do.
Can you imagine the pressure of having to keep readers happy day in and day out for the next 10, 20 or 30 years just to keep a paycheck? Not for me - those of you thinking that becoming an A-lister is the bomb should think about that. The work will never get easier and you will burn out and lose it all at some point.
Anonymous,
That has been rumored for a while now but I can't confirm it. If I create some hyphenated URL's in future I'll let you know. I wouldn't be concerned though as you should be creating quality content that will pass a human review anyway. A pain in the ass but it will help eliminate a lot of the spam I have to compete with so I'm in favor of it if true.
Mike,
I'm trying to get all my posts ready for the forum but keep getting sidetracked. Almost ready though. I would be but as you mentioned the Masters is this weekend and I've TIVO'd it and have a few holes left to watch - Tiger was 5 back when I stopped to catch up here. Don't tell me how the day ended - I will see the rest shortly! Lol.
Jack,
The site looks good but is way to general in scope. You might try turning into a local niche or target specific locations and see what happens. I wish I could give you the time but I'm swamped with requests at the moment.
Before you do anything do some research on keywords that are remotely relevant and then hone it down to terms that have decent paying ads. The PR3 is a bonus and the site could have potential but you need to target something specific to make it work.
Play with it a bit and let me know how you make out. I can help out more once you do the research.
Vic,
I hear ya. Slowly but surely you are being heard and you can bet your ass the A-listers have heard about you. I imagine they are a bit nervous as well... have you noticed you get criticized for your style but no one has been able to counter your message?
The fact is the A-List can't rebut what you say because there is no counter argument to defend themselves with. They do not help others make money online - they use others to make money only for themselves. Their methods only work for them - our methods work for everybody. The sooner folks realize this the better. (not better for the A-list though)
Btw - loved the new video. What a clown!
Frank,
I think you are right. Bored and tired with trying to maintain it and I doubt he is making much money with it. He had a gimmick and once the initial rush died down he realized that he would have to actually post something constructive on it to maintain the illusion and keep his readers interested. I think he is just trying to dump it while he can and get rid of the pressure.
Guest writers, Review Me posts and contests - it's not really much of a make money online blog. He's probably smart enough to realize that he doesn't want to spend the rest of his life posting crap like Chow. His parody will just become an imitation if not already.
Money Ideas,
Thanks. What data center are you in? I'm showing #5 for that term. (no quotes)
Jack,
Well done.
2 Questions; Any traffic? And did you get flagged for using the hyphenated URL?
Hey Grizz,
I know this is a subject you keep harping on. I think this article just reinforces the idea that no matter what kind of blog we have, learning to build search traffic that brings non-bloggers to our site, is the real key to making money.
When you're writing about they kind of readers who are subscribed to many MMO blog feeds, I just had to laugh and shake my head ... you're describing me!
... except I don't buy Anything. Even the latest and greatest "secrets".
Even on extremely useful blogs like yours, I'm pretty much dead weight. I'm not going to click your adsense, because I know I'm highly unlikely to buy the product ... so, it wouldn't be fair to the advertiser.
In short, I enjoy having blogging friends who are "like me". But when it comes to trying to make a few bucks, I'd just as soon meet people who are as unlike me as possible.
Catch up with you again soon,
Todd
Good perspective Grizz.
I refrained from commenting in Vic's post as emotions were really getting hot and that poor kid got bashed for his innocence which I think is a little bit tough on him.
I got scammed too when I was about his age, though under different circumstances, and so he gets my sympathy and should not have been in the receiving end. It was an expensive but life enhancing experience and I don't think he will ever get scammed again. At least I never got scammed ever again after my expensive lesson. LOL.
Yes, I agree with you. It's the scammer that we should go after. Not the "scammee". The "scammee" are usually innocent people who reads too many John Chow kind of blogs.
You know there was this young upstart who joined in the fray of MMO blogging using Blogger and she was complaining about getting no traffic and making 28 cents a week from her Adsense. She says her plan now is to go and make comments in 500 blogs so they will come to her blog and maybe start clicking on her Ads.
I don't know if I pitied her or I got pissed with her ignorance but after her third rant post and her fancy traffic generating ideas, I told her bluntly to stop her nonsense and gave her your blog link.
Dunno whether I hurt her or she really took my advise to stop and come "study" under you first, but I can't find her blog anymore. Did I just kill off a young blogger? LOL.
Sorry.. I really got carried away.
Todd,
Your not dead weight - you are the person I am writing for. As for buying stuff or clicking ads - believe me when I say I don't want you to. I have lots of search traffic for that.
One of the dangers of having adsense on a social blog is that your readers will try and help you out which is bad. The same IP's clicking ads day after day or even less often is not a good thing. This is why I have told people not to chase social traffic if they use adsense. It's not just a matter of low ctr - it's a matter of Google suspecting click fraud.
This blog is an anomaly - I have tons of search traffic and readers. All my other sites are search only so this is a learning experience for me too. Anyhow, as I have said before - I don't want my readers buying anything on here. I test crap for other sites using the search traffic. I have no intention of profiting from readers looking for help. Bad Karma.
Thanks Todd. Always enjoy your comments here and elsewhere - you have always struck me as a thinker.
Costa,
Your comment;
"complaining about getting no traffic and making 28 cents a week from her Adsense"
is so common and one of the biggest reasons I started explaining my methods. Adsense doesn't work without SEO. Period.
It's easy putting Adsense on a blog and that's why everyone tries it at one point or another. They are doomed though because they never bother learning how to optimize their blogs. In truth they probably don't even know that they have to do anything else - just slap on the ads and wait for the money.
It's unfortunate but I guess there aren't really many sites giving out the info needed to use adsense effectively and lets face it - most people who do make money with it aren't in a hurry to tell others. It would just create more competition for themselves. I tell people only because I'm sure most people won't do what I say anyway - too much like work. lol. Sad but lets admit it - most people are looking for the get rich quick thing that doesn't exist so I am in no danger of losing my positions in the serp's anytime soon.
Costa if she quit then you probably did her a favor - I wouldn't feel guilty about it. If she took your advice then she will be better off. Either way you helped her and thanks for the plug. You've been a good friend to me and I appreciate it.
Not good on the hyphenated urls, I have many of them, mostly for my BANS sites but like you said I think most would pass a review anyway.
As for the young man , this wont be the last time this happens and as i predicted people would coming running to shout what a good deal he got. 10K for a PR 4 domain which is essentially what he got seems rather high to me, but then it was nt my money. The making money online niche is not for me , Ill stick with the sites nobody wants to do and still make money online, lol
actually, i don't get much traffic at all.
but i noticed that somebody found me via the misspelling. so i updated the posts and such, and became ranked #1 for the misspelled name (like within hours). so i don't know how that's going to change my traffic - if any.
to answer your second question. i actually did get flagged when i first started the blog and had to submit for review. i thought it was somebody going around flagging people, but maybe the google flagging hyphenated domains thing is real. anyway, it was back up in a couple of days after i submitted it.
Don,
As you stated it - the MMO niche really isn't a money maker yet noob after noob starts a MMO blog. Yikes. It will never end.
Does anybody realize how many women have access to a computer? Does anyone realize how many queries are done everyday for Shoes? For Accessories? (Ok - I'm assuming most of the searches are done by women - I'm not being sexist and mean no disrespect.)
My point is that there are some huge money niches out there and you don't have to hide affiliate links or even answer comments. lol.
Don we can share all the good niches and leave MMO to the noobs.
Jack,
Keep working new posts on the proper spelling and don't let the blog die - I have a feeling she could become a country star in the future and the blog could pan out. Worth the effort in any case and you will have an aged site if she does hit the big time.
Thanks for the update on the hyphenated URL's. As I said - annoying but of no consequence if the sites are legit.
Grizz ! Have you been in my e-mail? shoes! You mean the item that every woman on the planet owns multiple pairs of? Seriously I need to have a chat with you one day soon. I have 3 or 4 ladies sitting on wait for me to come up with a niche for them
Cracking post.
My blog is not an MMO one (as you mentioned)... it is however a social one and it has been fun. Does it make money? Yes, but not enough relative to the time put in. However, I've met a few people and made some friends so it's been worth it.
I will be trying out some of the things you and Vic have mentioned - recently got my Adsense back. I am testing out ranking for terms on my blog at the moment - obscure ones, and not ones that will make me money, but ones that have some competition (to try out). Keep on tweaking and I will have something to work on for my niche websites - your blog is a perfect example that a site doesn't need to look flashy to make money, and I will be trying some of that, as well as experimenting with Blogspot (is it true that it is easier to rank?).
Personally, I make most of my money as a freelance writer, but have always wanted to have websites that generate revenue like clockwork - which this one certainly does. Thanks for the tips. :)
One question Griz, may be a dumb one. What are you getting by teaching us how to make money online.
My new blog using your advice is actually getting good traffic. It is in the fifth page of google. What happens when it reaches the first for the main keyword. Thank you.
Venkat
Hi Griz, well said as always.
It probably doesn't matter what you or Vic or anyone else says to try to warn people off paying big money for worthless blogs. The kind of people who get sucked in to that don't read blogs like this and have probably never heard of Vic.
I said it in one of my recent posts that "there is one born every minute" and its true. That post even got Yaro to poke his head round the door as I poked a bit of fun at him and Chow - the post started out as a paid review of TV stands and ended up as a full blown post on the merits or otherwise of video on blogs!
So we can't protect everyone and you can bet your bottom dollar Cow's site will probably be snapped up by some starry eyed noob who will crow about picking up the bargain of the century LNAO!
Can you imagine the mayhem if a bunch of good car salesmen got hold of a load of worthless blogs and proceeded to use their skills to sell them at top dollar?
We'd be seeing many more tales of woe!
Btw, the forum is still sitting there waiting - I disabled new signups again as no sooner did I enable it the spammers were back at it with a vengeance. Those bastards must sit there every night clicking the "register" tab just in case!
Terry
Griz,
I'm one of your 747 RSS subs. Lovin' your common sense explanations and am in total shock that someone can MMO with Blogger! I was always told that you "HAD" to use WP. LOL
Would you please tell us what a data center is?
Also, how can we get the information that you show in your charts of which keywords found your site?
Thanks. Dick Hillenbrand
http://ny-genes.blogspot.com
Don,
Shoes have so many long tails that get traffic it's not funny. I had done a post on Ugg boots once - forgot about it and then one day some woman who has a TV show that apparently every woman on the planet watches mentioned that her favorite boots were Uggs and suddenly I had more traffic than I had ever seen. Oprah something or other...
Croc shoes seemed the in thing for a while too...
There is always a new "Big Thing" in shoes...
Jason,
Don't get me wrong - social sites can be fun and interesting and they fill a need for most people. They just don't make much money as they aren't SEO friendly. Friends are great but if you are trying to sell them stuff all the time they won't be friends for long.
There is a reason this blog doesn't look flashy - if you are building niche sites you want the focus to be on the "money" click and the last thing you want is traffic that hangs around and reads. This blog has long since been transformed from it's original purpose but it still serves as an example of how to build a niche site.
It is true that blogger ranks easier but only because it's plain format right out of the box is perfectly optimized for SEO. There are no extras that the bot has to crawl and then figure out how to categorize. The bot knows exactly what my keywords are and can crawl the blog and posts with ease.
If you build niche sites then forget all the fancy crap and advice you hear from people about how a blog should look. Also - no social traffic - only search traffic. Don't submit it to social networks or stumble, digg etc. The only traffic you want to see for affiliate sites or adsense sites is from G. Period.
Good luck Jason
Venkat,
What am I getting from this? Well I've said this before - I am building up trust in my readers so one day I can sell you all a worthless ebook and make off like a bandit! lol
Actually I'm making a lot of friends and that's never bad and it does give me an easy way to write content for this blog. Talking about stuff I know about is a lot easier than writing affiliate sales pages about crap.
Remember that while I write for my readers I optimize for the search engines and bring a lot of traffic to this site. The search traffic takes one look and clicks away in a hurry because the blog is so ugly and doesn't offer a get rich quick scheme for them. This traffic makes me money while I get to tell my readers how the search traffic makes me money.
When you reach page 1 you should see a lot more traffic assuming your keyword(s) are something that people are searching for. Remember ranking is easy if there is no interest in the subject. The key is ranking for keywords that get a lot of searches and these type of keywords have a lot of competition.
Terry,
You are probably right - the real suckers never bother with due diligence and can't be helped. In any event if these posts help to convince the smarter crowd who are on the fence about something then great.
Which post did you slam Yaro - I mst have missed it - you have so many bloody sites! Lol.
Leave the link I want to read it.
Sorry about the Forum - I'm almost done with the posts - can I add them ahead of time without anyone seeing them. Yes - you know how useless I am with all that technical mumbo you and Vic blab on about. :-)
Dick,
Nice to hear from one of my quiet readers!
If you are trying to be famous with a socia blog then wordpress is the way to go.
If you want to make money then any platform will work but don't bother with all the bells and whistles. I built this blog to simply prove that a free ugly blogger blog can kick ass in the serp's and make money. Anyone who says differently is full of ... Please direct them here and let them tell me how I am doing things wrong. lol.
Targeted keyword optimized content and keyword targeted backlinks - that's all that anyone needs to make money online. Period. Everything else is just fluff and will bugger up your SEO.
I use Statcounter.com to collect the stats you see regarding keywords etc. The counter is free and tracks all the keyword stats necessary to run a successful blog. It's all I use.
A data center referrs to the area you live in. If I do a search on Google my results are from Google.ca (Canada) and will likely be a bit different from your results if you live in a different data center. Google.com is the US center. Google.ie is Ireland etc.
The difference in results is because Google assumes that because I live in Canada I might want to see the top Canadian sites in my results as well as the top worldwide sites. It's a bit more complex than that but gives a general idea of what is going on.
45n5, Yaro and Andy Beard show the same downward trend. They all feel it has something to do with Alexa changing it's program but I'm not sure.
If there are changes they've done nothing but help me. My position has dropped 300,000 spots.
Oh, but wait. I've been getting more traffic, thanks to better SEO.
Hmm, maybe it's not changes to Alexa after all. Lol.
Griz and all,
I have tons (several dozen) of hyphenated domains, all blogger blogs. One has been flagged and one got de-indexed but neither for the hyphens (I suspect). Last week I added several with hyphens and they're all indexed as of this morning. I'll let you know if I run into any problems.
Thom
Fiar,
I'm with you - my Alexa is going the right way for all that it really matters.
Funny thing about SEO - it works. Ain't that a kick in the pants!
Hope all is good Fiar.
Thanks for the update Thom.
The mystery deepens. I'm sure keywords play the major role in being flagged but it would be nice to get a handle on this.
The one day I don't check your site and you post. :-( The feed is always a day late in my e-mail.
I really need to go back through and figure out how you are getting your ranks with keyword. It still seems to be evading me.
Your post is sure inspiring. I need to learn how to write longer posts, that I do know.
Most of my traffic seems to come through my Squidoo lenses. For whatever reason I can rank better with those than I can with my blogs.
Blogger,
I like to wait until you all give up checking and then sneak in a post! Lol.
Feedburner is always a day late - I wish it would just send the feed out upon publishing. Maybe it does and I just don't have a clue how to set it up properly - any of you tech types feel free to chime in but please speak in English only. I just hear mmmmphfff when you start talking that programing gibberish! Ha.
Keywords 101
1) Use the keyword in your post title. (and Blog Title for Bonus points and URL for really great bonus points)
2) Get as many backlinks using the keyword in the anchor text as you can.
That really does sum up SEO in all it's complexity. That's how I rank well for all my keywords.
Finding the right keywords is of course a whole different issue. "Ugg Boots" was a great keyword - might have mentioned that above.
Keep at it Blogger - it will all come together eventually.
Thanks Grizz!
I definitely am going to keep at it.
Guess I will run another SEO Elite and see what I am missing for certain niches.
Don't know why it is signing me in as Blogger.
Denise
Denise,
Ha... so you're Blogger! Now you tell me. lol.
You are signed in under a different account. That's the post name you use for your survey blogs. Happens to me all the time too - I forget to check which blogger account I'm logged in under.
Denise - as a woman - have you heard about shoes? (Kidding)
If you find some you think might be decent keywords send me an email and I'll either steal them or give you my opinion. If I steal them you know they are good.
Feedburner is always a day late - I wish it would just send the feed out upon publishing.
It works OK for me. I put up a new post this morning and it's there in my feeds. I don't know if being on blogger could be a factor or if there's something in the settings, because I do think it has the ability to configure how often and when your feeds are published. I'll give it a look and see if I figure anything out.
Yes, all is well. Thanks for asking.
Damn, I knew if I whined about it some one would do the work for me - you're a good man Fiar!
I await your expertise but expect that the problem is located somewhere between my ears.
Oh a note to all...
I will be tied up this afternoon watching Tiger kick some butt in the Masters but will be back later.
Thanks again Fiar.
Griz
One more thing I would like to mention as we continue to stray off topic here:
Practicing better SEO has also landed me a new co-author. You see, by writing for search engines, so to speak, G ranked me for a term that is relevant to my content. I ranked 2nd for a term this guy was looking for.
He hit my contact form and told me he wanted to publish this 6 part series that he wrote some time ago. I looked at it and liked what I saw.
He's now signed on for a continuing tenure. This guy writes some marathon posts, but it's all great stuff.
Don't ever listen to the "advice" that you shouldn't write for search engines. Writing for search engines IS writing for people. Because people use search engines to find content.
It MAY have something to do with using blogger. I don't know who you ping when you update. I know that I have automatic pinging when I update. Looked in feedburner and saw this:
The trouble: Your FeedBurner feed isn't up-to-date with your Original Feed.
The fix: Try pinging FeedBurner using our Ping page. This action tells FeedBurner to go check your feed for updates immediately.
So far, I don't see the configuration I thought was there, though. I could swear it has the ability to batch the whole week into one delivery, which I would assume would also allow for delaying feeds 24 hours as well, but I don't think that's it anyway, because there's no way that would be the default setting, and - Clearly - you didn't do anything to change that setting. Lol. That was one hell of a run on sentence.
Hi Grizz,
wondering had you check this site? It actually submits your site to major search engine for free, seems to good to be true for me but more or less, traffic does increase. Hope to hear from you soon!
You and Vic is simply Great!
"if i submit my URL to site like www.submitexpress.com, is it good or bad or better not too? Hope to hear from you soon =)
P.S: I once used it before and i got some traffic from there"
Houston
Griz,
Thanks for the great posts and stats! i was wondering what program you used for them.
I am using Google Analytics but have been looking for something different.
Hey, you had mentioned to sign up under different blogger accounts. Just wondering you you use Adsense on each of them and how blogger doesn't put two and two together that you are the same person. Is that against TOS or any problems with it?
Elliott
Thank you for the long and insightful post. Again, you filled my heart.
Even if I had the money, I wouldn't bought JohnCow...
@ Niche Blogging
Thanks for the great posts and stats! i was wondering what program you used for them.
Grizz is using Statcounter in the screenshots. It's a free tracker at statcounter.com
PS, I hate blogger's comments. I like how, even if you wanted to enable moderation in Wordpress, there's a setting that allows moderation for first timers, or certain flags, and others get immediate approval.
That would be so cool here. Has Google/Blogger never logged on to the intertubes?
Griz,
Any update on the forum discussed in previous posts?
Thanks
gotafish
poor kid.
can't believe he'd part with $10k without knowing ANYTHING about blogging.
I also find it strange that a 24 year kid doesn't have a blog.
Geez am I late or what Grizz? Anywho, good stuff on the MMO blogs. I think I owe ya on some commenting, LOL! Remember the little thing we talked about last time?
Hit me up when you get a chance. I sent an email but I know you have been slammed.
Alright - time to catch up.
Fiar,
"Writing for search engines IS writing for people."
I couldn't have said that better.
Blogger pings Weblogs automatically but I will try feedburner as well and see if that does the trick. I just checked the delivery options in Feedburner and they only offer the choice of a daily time period for delivery rather than a "deliver now" option. This is likely the problem.
You are right about Blogger's inept comment system - I am stunned that a company with the brains of Google behind them can't or won't upgrade this crappy comment section to at least be on par with those available for other platforms.
Btw - I loved the run on sentence - if a real writer like you can get away with it then I'm off the hook! lol.
Houston,
I did check out submitexpress.com and as I thought it is a standard search engine submission program. I never submit to search engines as all of them are crap except G but if it worked for you then who am I to say don't. I will tell you this though - never submit to Google - you will wait forever - get links and let them find you. This is much faster than submitting to them.
As for other search engines if they can't find me they aren't much of an engine and in truth they won't provide much traffic. However - if it worked for you - great.
Elliot,
I use Statcounter for tracking my stats. It's free and provides everything I need. I also check the stats on feedburner and MyBlogLog occasionally but more for interest than necessity.
I don't spend a lot of time checking stats to be honest - the only stat I care about is what keywords are being used to find my sites. Remember this is where I find long tails to target that I was unaware of.
If a obscure long tail brings me some traffic and it's ranked on page 5 then I boost it up to page one and usually find there is a lot of interest. My hubpages post has been bringing in all sorts of traffic for various terms I wouldn't have thought of and Statcounter has provided me with the keywords.
Google and Blogger don't care if you have a million sites or just one. They only care if you have spam sites. If all your sites are legit - no problem. I use multiple accounts because too many on one account triggers the spam filter and then you have to get a manual review which I will pass but it is annoying. To avoid the annoyance use multiple accounts.
Weeds,
You're welcome. You can buy a lot of "weed" for 25K... lol.
Gotafish,
I'm almost ready - have had to re-write several times.
Will be this week.
Dividends,
Judging by the kids latest post - he is doomed.
Justin,
I'm looking - would you believe I have 6 different Justin's in the email to do list - what's the subject line? My emails are completely flooded now and I'm getting farther behind by the day - tell the truth this is why I haven't been able to get the forum going.
Folks I am going to have to take a hiatus from emails just to catch up on my work. I'll get to all of it eventually but pleeeeeeease ask your questions in the comments so I don't have to answer the same questions over and over again.
Thanks.
Justin just give me the subject so I can find it quickly.
IMO John Cow is one of the worst examples of a "Rob Your Readers" blog out there.
The "selling due to personal reasons" has been used on that site before, when they offloaded "the million euro wiki".
They also offloaded their google spam scam "Google Time"... saying how much they had made off it by amongst other things... buying bulk traffic for $25... ROFL
I read with interest some of the comments on the sitepoint sale... someone asked why the earnings had been quoted on the site at $5k per month, but now were $2.5k... questioning "why the drop".
Someone also asked how many hours a week they took to run it...
You would have to be a maniac to pay $25k for that site, without the author beavering away on it, and Chows patronage it ain't worth very much at all.
Did you ever track the demise of careerramblings.com
That site sold for $20k as a PR6... the person that built it spammed netscape (before propellor) and sapped link juice from its high PR pages... and took advantage of its click happy user base.
Now it is PR0, Alexa died some time ago.
As you say blogs only real value, as a website is in its organic listings / PR etc.
Invariably the RSS readership evaporates with the departure of the author and so, within a month all you have left is organic...
So Griz do you use a new email account to sign up with each new blogger account? Like create a new gmail account for each one?
Adsense on those sites don't matter then if G and Blogger are ok with one person creating multiple accounts, right?
I will check out StatCounter, and for checking my stats, that is what I use analytics for just for the longtail keywords and checking them so that I can target new ones that people have used to find my sites and increase my rankings for new terms and then can put more stuff on my site for those long term keywords plus then I can hopefully use more longtail keywords that will increase my rankings for even more longtail keywords and then really bring more traffic to my sites.
WHewwwww....hows that for a long ass sentence! lmao
I guess my concern is if I am creating multiple blogger accounts with different email accounts of mine, I don't want to get in trouble with Google or Blogger for the same IP address or Adsense account showing up. I can understand the spam site issue, and these wouldn't be spam sites, legit content all the way.
Thanks for the help!
Elliott
you keep on saying that alexa traffic is nothing but why you keep posting the differences of each site alexa ranking... yaeh yeah yeah..blabla...
Griz - My Duosonic/eBay Blogger blog is still flagged. It's been flagged since last Monday and is still awaiting a manual review. Any hints on getting it out of review status?
Angrycat,
Can't add much to your comment. You appear to be on top of the "site flipping" niche - far more than I am.
As mentioned, the only sites I would ever look at as an investment would have to have solid search traffic built on keywords that can be monetized.
Thanks for those examples - very interesting and on point.
Elliot,
I use different emails for each account. I can only say that I have been doing this for ages and have never had a problem with multiple accounts using adsense.
I have to mention this though and it is important. I don't use adsense on all my accounts. I only use adsense on my main blogs. If you build 100 blogs and slap adsense on all of them two things will happen;
You will be smart priced and flags will go up.
Remember adsense TOS states that you can not just build a site for the purpose of showings adsense. Your sites must be quality sites offering unique and useful information to readers.
Can anyone tell me that they can maintain 100 blogs and provide unique and useful info on all 100 of them.
No.
And Google will check because they don't think you can either. And when they check they will see garbage and you will lose your account.
Be smart - I maintain a small roster of excellent quality sites that I have Adsense on. I also use it on short term sites when appropriate and only if I am not smart priced and I can keep the quality up. When the run is over I remove the adsense.
I do have hundreds of blogs but they have many purposes and while I have used adsense on many of them at one time or another it is not something you just slap on a blog and forget about. You have to maintain adsense blogs and constantly monitor them for smart pricing or your best sites will suffer drastically.
The best advice I can give is to ask yourself if what you are doing could be explained legitimately to someone at Google if you are flagged. Could you make a case that you have 20 quality sites never mind 100. What would you believe to be reasonable?
In the end you have to use common sense and if something doesn't seem possible to you or isn't natural then don't do it.
Niche Marketing.
I had may of the same concerns myself. G isn't really "spying" on us to that degree. Like Grizz said, the purpose of using multiple accounts is that spammers tend to use many blogs on one account, so that triggers a flag.
As long as you aren't spamming, you're ok, but using multiple accounts can reduce the headache a bit.
Once statcounter is tracking you, look for the "recent keyword activity" and "keyword analysis" links in the left sidebar to see what long tail terms to include in new content.
My figging "n" key isn't working well. I have to keep redoing it. Grr.
@Anon - What publicly available traffic metric do you recommend Grizz use then?
Thought so.
Frank C,
The Blogger employees set up a spreadsheet last month in Google groups for people to submit their blogs which have been flagged as spam and as yet not been reviewed. Maybe you could try this:
http://groups.google.com/group/blogger-help-loginissues/browse_thread/thread/c94ee6dbd82cbf68#
I think they said something about you having to have already had submitted a request for review prior to this (without any response). You might wish to start a thread too but go through just a few to determine what the current 'mood' is.
Note that I have not tried it so I do not know if they do respond. I got a blog reinstated prior to this and basically just kept asking politely for them to do it quick. Other bloggers started asking why I got help but they didn't - I can only say I asked politely. Those guys are just employees at the end of the day so don't be too hard on them - millions of blogs to go through I'm sure lol
I posted this earlier in the previous post's comments but apparently Grizz thought I might have been spamming heheheh
Anonymous,
Why do morons who can't think insist on proving how poor their analytical skills are?
And why do people who make such "confident" statements always hide behind the anonymity curtain? Are you afraid to stand behind your statement?
First - "keep posting the differences of each site alexa ranking."
This would imply that I do this often? Where else?
Second - "you keep on saying that alexa traffic is nothing"
Yup - all the time. It means nothing in regards to "making money online". Only bloggers are counted in it's stats - not search traffic. You don't make money from bloggers.
This post however dealt with how many readers the A-list have - ie. Bloggers and as such I posted the Alexa rankings in order to show that their readership is dwindling. Since this is the only traffic the A-list gets as they, for the most part have little search traffic, their Alexa rankings mean something to them - not me.
Now how do you infer that by discussing the fact that the A-list is losing readers I am somehow contradicting myself in my claim that Alexa has no meaningful use for making money online?
The most intelligent thing you said was "blabla..."
Please leave a name and URL next time so we can all see what kind of genius you are.
Fiar,
Hehe... nice one but wasted as he/she will never understand the term "metric" - lol. or Anon for that matter :-)
YC, (and Frank)
Thanks and sorry I missed your previous attempt. You may spam away YC! Try a hypertext link as your text got cut off - stupid Blogger.
Frank that's a better answer than I can give. I suspect they are simply swamped at the moment given the changes to their flagging system.
I dont see any difference between you and John Chow.. both of you are such a show off..if you are really good then why keep mentioning someone as famous as him..or if you have more fame than him, then why keep making him famous..... or your one of those social climber who is so insecure of John chow?.. why cant you just blog without pointing fingers to someone in a negative way.. And I am not a Moron..you are..because you leave in a weirderness...lols..
I am a spam...just like you!!!! very much like you...you nerdie!!!! ashole..leave your URL too when you spam and I will leave my URL too...stupid
LMAO... brilliant!
I must be on the radar now...
This anonymous guy talks like Yoda.. Except I can usually decifer the point Yoda is trying to make. I guess he doen't like you talking about John Chow??
BTW.. who in the hell uses the word "nerdie" LMAO...
Dennis,
Are you saying you didn't feel he made a lucid and well thought out response? Lol
Wasn't hard to find his/her button...
I thought Chow was a better writer than that though...
Who knows Grizz??
I tend to lean towards the person that can make an argument such as you did with this post. You back up your argument by providing examples and reasonable metrics in which to gauge the value of a website.
I also tend to believe your readers can spot an idiot.. Anyone who just says your "stupid", is an idiot in my book..
They should state why you or anyone is for that fact is "stupid" if making a statement.
I would like to see a post that says your analysis is full of crap.. The closest I have found is someone that put a $$ on RSS subscribers. In which case I had a hard time buying their analysis..
Dear Grizz,
after looking at your blog, Vic's blog, court's blog, I am starting to realise something important, you guys are for real! I don't know what to say.... really... I thank you all!
One fine day, I will defintely go to your door steps and thanks you all!
God Bless All Of You! Godspeed!
Houston
Anon is quite the moron. May I have free reign to do some troll bashing, Mr. Grizzly sir? I have a vast range of experience with my political humor background.
Lol. Just kidding. I agree with Dennis here. We all see the transparent idiocy. Nuff said.
Here's a real request, though. On my political humor site, and who knows what future sites ;), I need a strategy that goes beyond my main keywords.
Terms like, Political humor, satire, and parody, are good for a few hundred visits each, with top ranking. That's not really the way people look for what is in the content of the site.
It's the long tails, but I need tons of them to get where I really want to be. For example, people don't look for political humor, they look for John McCain jokes, or Barack Obama parody.
I understand the strategy of leveraging your keyword rankings to build on it. Something we discussed here. But what I want to know is how to do this a little more intentionally.
I know you're doing this at this site. Like you try the keyword Hubpages, or Yahoo Answers, and then I bet you get search traffic for things like, Squidoo for beginners, or make money with hubpages.
That's where I need to go to really do some search engine damage. I know it's a little more advanced technique that may confuse some newbies, but I'd really like to see some more info on how to do that a little more strategically.
Just for fun, one of my favorite search terms I get: John McCain not for president. Yes, people actually search for that.
ROTFL. Thank my co-author Chris for that one.
Sorry Frank C and Griz, here's the link you'll do better going to the parent directory for login issues:
http://groups.google.com/group/blogger-help-loginissues/topics
As for Mr Anonymous, judging from the language/grammar, it looks to me to be someone from my part of the world and a young know-it-all. lol
I also have a political blog. I am also surprised at the number of people searching about John McCain. I have taken a break from that blog to work on other niches. Interesting enough here's my long tail "john McCain's political accomplishments"
It would be funny to see you put a spin on that one..
Great post Grizz.
I do see some benefits from these blogs that focus on social media. I do think that they help their owners in the offline world. If you want to develop your personal brand and get a job for a tech site or in some new media company, I do think that these blogs are good for that. Look at Scoble and Darren Rouse. They have built up great brands online.
Interesting.. I see John cow stopped by your blog.. Maybe he will try to pay you off to write a "positive review" of his site. :o)
Grizz,
I also wanted to ask you a question. For your adsense blogs, how much in daily adsense revenue do you set as a minimum for each site?
The reason why I ask is that I think that I am going for too high of keywords. I am starting to see some increase in my SE traffic for my adsense blogs, but I think maybe I am just not creating enough blogs. Do you go for a quantity of blogs as opposed to building a few with a lot of revenue each?
Thanks as always,
Fred
Houston,
You're a kind fellow Houston and most welcome.
Fiar,
Trolls and politics? Hmmm I can't see the connection at all. lol
If I was running a political site I would probably monitor the scraper sites like;
http://www.rawstory.com/
http://www.truthout.org/
http://www.buzzflash.net/
(Sorry I just had to use the Liberals - ha)
The idea being to keep up on the hot stories and post the same little blurbs like they do. This will keep Google crawling you constantly and give you tons of (current) long tails in the serp's. Adding your humorous spin to these stories will build a steady readership. (Think Wonkette)
These sites are nothing more than elaborate scrapers - yet they have high PR and large readerships because political readers want current news and want it all in one place.
It's a lot of work but these sites have lots of general advertisers and tend to sell for a good buck because of the traffic they get. They get lots of free backlinks too.
I'm not suggesting you turn your legit site into a scraper site but maybe set up a new one and give it a try. People like these types of sites because they can find all the stories in one place and click on the ones that interest them. Add your spin to the snippets. Lots of long tail headlines for the serp's and link bait for other sites as well as outrageous Titles to lure in the readers. It seems to work well for others.
Just a thought.
If this doesn't turn your crank I can probably come up with some other ideas. I mention this only because I have toyed with the idea myself but not followed through with it. The fact that The Huffington Post, Daily KOS and The Drudge Report are worth millions makes this niche kinda interesting.
In any event current news snippets are an easy way to add lot's of long tails to your posts even if you just add them to the side bar or have a "Latest News" section below each post. Will you get penalized for duplicate content - look at the PR of all the news sites that do this. Google doesn't seem to have a problem with the news... double standard or what?
Would love to discuss this more though.
Dennis, what's your monetization strategy for a political site? I don't think adsense is the way to go. The research I've done into it shows it doesn't pay, or have you experienced differently?
But here's the thing. I guess a rephrasing of my previous comment. You see whatever happened last night on the daily show at the top of google trends. You see how big a site like huffpo or captain's quarters is.
There's a huge market there, but how do I tap into the search engine traffic, then how do I monetize? I'm not going to rehash the daily show, and I'm not going to do all Ron Paul, all the time. Sure, I COULD do a site like that, but I don't want to go that way.
I have better, more profitable niche site ideas.
I could go the social media route, but that's too fickle, and tiresome, especially for my personality type. I want SEARCH ENGINE traffic, and I want it big time.
As I said before, that site's not about the money. But it would be nice to get something out of it financially, if I'm going to do it anyway.
John McCain's accomplishments. Hmm. I might have an idea or two rolling around on that.
Thanks YC :-)
Dennis,
The Cow has been by a few times - never leaves a cow-ment though. Hahaha - OK Lame!
He seems to be having problems selling the site - read his latest post.
See my remark re: politics to Fiar.
Fred,
There are lot's of benefits to social blogging if you can get to the top. The problem is that 99% will not get to the top and starve for years trying to do it only to finally give up.
Kinda like mediocre musicians dreaming of becoming famous - at what point do their friends tell them maybe it's time to get a real job. No one likes to douse someone's dreams but we have to keep it real too.
What are the chances that all 10,000,000 bloggers currently trying to get famous are going to make it? I say screw the fame and take the money. Much better odds.
Fred - Part 2 (Damn - I should read more than one comment at a time! lol)
I try out lots of blogs in order to see where the money is but get rid of the adsense pretty quick on the ones that don't perform. (Don't want smart pricing on my good ones) See my reply to Elliot above regarding quantity/quality.
As for a minimum it was $10 a day then $30 a day - then $50 and now I basically look for the $100 a day niches. Keep in mind I only target the most competitive niches - your minimum will be much less until you are ready to take on the big boys.
Just remember that having a hundred Adsense blogs making a $1 a day isn't practical and you will likely be producing spam sites which will get you banned.
I have lots of decent traffic sites that just don't generate high CPC and instead of making $5 a day with adsense I turned them into affiliate sites or advertising sites. Some I don't monetize at all and use them for links or I funnel the traffic to other sites that do make money.
The days of building tons of spam blogs loaded with Adsense are over. Targeted quality blogs only these days.
Griz - What would you call "targeted quality" content?
For example, recently I've run across a ton of home repair and improvement sites with either rambling keyword packed text that says almost nothing or are simply glorified scrapper sites yet they have Adsense all over the place and rank well for a variety of long tail terms. I suppose that if they were in a highly competitive field like credit cards they would be reported all the time but they seem to be unscathed in their relatively uncompetitive niche. (for an example see fixya.com)
Grizz, I usually arrive when most of everybody else is packing up, LOL. But I did read everything from top to bottom. You never fail to amaze with your insights. Definitely, this post is awesome. So many key points to take note of as far as search engine traffic is concerned and "bored" bloggers trying to jump off the wagon before things start going farther south. Like Vic, you're showing us the way. I concur the so-called A-listers are quietly slip sliding away as your Alexa charts showed. Boy, times they are a-changing.
LOL I love your blog!
The moral of the story is to always do your homework before you buy a site. Check out the site owner's claims.
Ask yourself questions like:
Is the traffic stream defensible?
Where will this site be in 12 months?
What's the competition?
What other income streams can you get from the site?
How old is the domain?
Which keywords are ranked?
What's the site worth if Google deindexes it tomorrow?
Could the money be spent on something else for a better return?
Frank,
I checked out fixya.com and have to say it's a very clever site. Tons of long tails and the guests basically provide all the content. Yup it's a glorified Adsense site but it does meet the requirements of providing useful info for the readers - or at least the illusion. I have no idea whether the experts actually solve any problems - the ones I checked didn't but the attempt was made. (no one will click the ads if they solve the readers problems... billiant) Hate to say it but the site would pass review and I have no doubt it makes tons of money.
My version of targeted quality content is more along the lines of providing tons of info on let's say "fishing rods".
You guessed it - long long articles explaining everything there is to know about every type, make and model of fishing rod known to man. From a readers perspective I give out legit info. The serp's rank me for tons of long tails. My articles presell the best paying ads but don't sell anything directly. I want xyz fishing rod ads and I sum up my article by inferring that the absolute best rod to buy is xyz brand and leave it at that. No links - no info on where to find the rod. Now the reader wants more info on the rod - like the price and where to buy which I forgot to mention - and low and behold there is that handy little ad sitting in the sidebar for just the thing he was looking for.
Now I don't really do this with fishing rods but the technique works wonders for people wondering what kind of GPS unit is best or which fish finder is the most accurate or what lures are best for what fish and so on.
My articles could be on wikipedia. They are useful for the reader and they just happen to be really well optimized for bringing up the best CPC ads available.
Now every niche is different but the concept is always the same. Don't use spam - write real articles but always lead the article in the direction of needing the ads to solve the readers final question. Sure 95% of the visitors who actually stay leave after reading the article but some take the extra step and click. Most visitors see an ugly blog and hit the back button or click an ad and bugger off. Win/win.
Yes lots of low competition niches still have tons of spam sites but these sites don't and can't outrank a site that provides the type of content I provide and coupled with anchored backlinks I have no competition. They can't report me but I can slam them. (I don't though because they only make my site look that much more legitimate)
I guess I am saying that it is possible to write really useful posts and still leave the reader looking for an answer - you just have to change the question for them.
Great content plus ugly layout = money.
Thanks Markk,
I don't think the A-list will disappear anytime soon but they may have to change their marketing strategy as more noobs become familiar with the crap they currently pimp.
Christine,
Well, aren't you just a sweetheart! I love your comments! lol.
just to jump in on the conversation, my current goal is to only make 10 bucks a day with adsense, maybe 15 max (with each site). i wouldn't to go much over that, so i'd be more likely to sell it in the 5-7K range instead of asking someone to pony up 25K.
Hock,
I think your list is more applicable to buying a social site rather than a money making site.
I only need to see four things - search traffic, what keywords are ranked where, what those keywords pay and how many relevant profitable keywords can still be added.
I can get to the top of the serp's regardless of age or competition and I don't mix income streams on a money site. I just need to know that the keywords produce the kind of income needed to justify the expense and effort.
Of course you may not have been talking about the kinds of sites that would interest me...
Jack,
The funny thing about adsense revenue is that it is consistent and once you start making it you may never sell the site. It is Eldorado. Why sell something that takes little work and just keeps paying you day after day quite conceivably for years?
It's retirement income.
If you get to $15 a day then you'll know how to get to $30 a day and then $50 and you won't be selling anything. I truly hope you get the opportunity to find out first hand.
Grizzly, great post, again and again! I've nothing to say that as not being said, it's not a good business to buy a blog like that in this days.
I take this ocasion and comment to ask you some more insights, if possible. I would like to know this:
When you create a new blog/site, after the launch, how many days do you spend geting links?
There is no way John Cows blog is worth $50k without him. The only reason he has a following is because people like him and his content but when he leaves, so will the readers.
I am not john Chow, I wish I am but I am not. And I agree to all of your hypocrite readers that you're good however, your blog title shouln't be "for beginners"because you sounds like you are too scared that these noobs will eventually surpass what you know. your blog is not really to help beginers by calling anyone as noobs!!! it just show how unprofessional you are so dont own the thrown since this thrown is for Probloggers who never point fingers to anyone on his post.
did you know how rude you sound? and newbies should never learn this attitude from you ...
never stab anyone at the back and if even someone do, you should remain your professional attitude by keeping your self as silent as you can....if... you are confident enough of what you got.. Are you????...
Btw - you might want to check out Sitepoint, to say that MMO sales are saturating the market would be an understatement to say the least.
Cow's on sale + four other medium sized MMO blogs. Will be interesting to see what they go for :)
Dinheiro,
There is no set answer to that question as each blog is different and requires it's own strategy.
The goal of every blog is to rank on top of page 1 or as close to that position as is reasonable. Asia'h Epperson didn't require many links to get to second spot and trying to overtake American Idol's site for top spot isn't feasible or necessary so I didn't spend a lot of time link building.
Getting to the top of a highly competitive niche like "make money online" is the opposite extreme. You need links continuously to stay on page 1 and you never stop building them.
Keep in mind that getting your home page a spot high in the rankings isn't the only goal. You also want to get every page in your blog ranked high for it's own keyword and this requires far more links than just getting the home page ranking. The more pages ranking for as many terms as you can think of is how you get massive amounts of traffic.
The short answer is that you never stop link building although some blogs require more than others to start ranking well.
Mark,
I am in agreement and must admit I am curious if anyone will bite. This is a huge problem with all the personality driven blogs and a new owner will have a hard time convincing readers to stay.
Does anyone know of an example of a branded personal site being sold and then growing successfully under new ownership? I'm not saying it hasn't happened but curious if anyone knows of one.
Anonymous,
You have been trolling here for two days now.
What is your point?
Rude? Maybe you should go back and read your comments.
I have found you amusing but unless you have something constructive to add or a question in need of answering please don't return.
Good luck to you.
Thanks Jason,
As I've said, if someone is selling a MMO site then it can't be making much money for the work involved and really isn't a true MMO site.
I haven't looked at the sites you mention but let me guess - they resemble every other TLA pushing, social traffic advocating, ten steps to succeed with Twitter, how to get more stumblers, best wordpress plug in and how to make your site the prettiest darn blog in the universe site and none of them rank for a single MMO keyword? (but they have a 125 affiliate link on board for SEO book)
Just guessing.
You are right Jason - it will be interesting to see what they sell for.
Anonomous,
You back again? I can see you recognize this blog holds value. Of course this blog would not appear as the “absolute” beginner’s site to MMO, due to the complexity or targeted questions asked in his comments sections. However you should realize the reason why it does not appear as a beginner’s site is due to way Grizz provided initial documentation about “making money online”. After his readers have completed reading his lessons and guides and visiting the sites Grizz recommends, his readers are able to draw upon his teachings, their personal experience and form educated questions that a beginner would not even have the knowledge to ask prior to reading his lessons.
Along those some lines I have watched Grizz patiently answer the same questions over and over. I have also watched him answer questions such as “what is a keyword” a question that anyone that took the time read his lessons should have understood. Yet, he patiently answers the question with the amount of detail and respect that anyone could hope to receive.
Fiar,
About monetation, I agree about the adsense. I removed it from my blog. However, there are definitely ads out there for the political arena. My issue is it was my first blog I started on Dec 11,2007 after reading Grizz’s blog. The interesting thing is I moved it to a PR2 in about 2.5 months. An interesting accomplishment since I never really paid attention to PR prior to reading Grizz’s blog. But, as you know PR didn’t do jack for getting traffic. However, it became a resource hog (time) and I wanted to work on niches that I could move more quickly and I didn’t do my keywords the right way on the blog or the articles I submitted. It was a learning experience. Plus, I think I actually answered questions,, which was a downfall. I noticed people were sitting on my site reading for way to long. Of course, my Back linking strategies are weak and I intend to work on that more starting in May when I return from a trip for work. I am going to try BMD and some other ideas I have from past experiences. If your interested search for “Political Machine” I am on page 5. I was on page 3 and slipped back. Well, back to the 8:00-5:00
BTW; I have read your site.. I am sure you can cleverly insert :”real clear politics” somehow. Check out the keyword search.
This is indeed a valuable site but also needs some lesson from the author's attitude towards beginners . a friendly advice Mr Grizzly, show a straight professionalism to get as much as Probloggers respect.
Why dont you visit Probloggers and learn where he get his topic to post instead of snooping on someone else site. Looks like you are a big fan of John Chow and watching all his moves.
I dont know john chow and now I am curious to see his sites because whether you say positive or negative to other people, it is one way of promoting his site.
Or maybe he is too famous and you want some attentions from his readers in this way. I will check out John Chow site and see what bother you so much about his tricks especially in seeling some of his sites.
I am just pointing out here that John Chow and grizzly have not much difference regarding "Dirty Tricks" on MMO...
Focus on what you do MR Grizzly and stop looking at someone else dirty trick. No matter how good you are, this will all go back to you to your face because Not all your readers hypocrites!!!
Dennis,
Thanks for that but I think something is being lost in translation with our friend Anon.
Hey Griz,
You can publish your stuff in the new forum I set up (The Bike Shed) and no one else will see it as its private. The SE bots don't even go in there.
When the members start joining they'll have to email me so I can upgrade their account so they can also see the hidden forum - nothing can happen on that front of course until I get the word to re-open the doors.
I might set up a time window for that then slam them shut again to keep the spammers out. I'll figure that out when the time comes.
BTW I hope your troll is using a good anonymous proxy, I'd hate to think he might be leaving a trail and then it turns out he lives in a glass house, if you get my meanin...
Anonymous,
It is apparent that you haven't really read my blog or have the slightest idea of what I am doing here.
Your welcome to learn.
I won't post anymore of your comments unless you leave a name and URL and have something useful to say. You are wasting my time with this nonsense.
Thanks Terry,
Just what I wanted to know.
The Troll isn't worth the effort - something wrong there though. Lol.
Thanks Terry.
PS: that's another thing Blogger could learn from WP - tracking incoming comments...
I thought the Kool-Aid was supposed to kill you.
That's right. You can't kill a brainless zombie.
John Cow, is that you?
@Dennis, Thanks for the input. I saw a referral from my blogger profile yesterday, and I thought it might be you.
@Grizz, The posting 10 times a day strategy is not at all feasible unless I wanted to put all my eggs into that one basket, but I want a more diverse portfolio of websites than that.
I do follow memeorandum for ideas, but it's a lot more hit or miss that you might realize.
I miss the days where Technorati brought traffic. Back then it was so easy to pick a hot topic and get 500 visits in 2 hours, just from Technorati.
Grizz,
This comment section is awesome. I am finally understanding better about building blogger blogs.
Keywords however always throw me off. I always seem to rank for the wrong ones.
So you use several differnt keywords in your anchors for back links on each page to rank for? Or do you stay with the same keyword to anchor backlinks for on each post?
Terry,
He/she is using the surfease proxy - China - never would have guessed.
http://www.surfease.com/
Host Name 78.169.52.123.broad.ly.ha.dynamic.163data.com.cn
IP Address 123.52.169.78 Troll [Edit Label]
Country China
Region Beijing
City Beijing
ISP Chinanet Henan Province Network
Btw - what's the URL for the Yaro slam? Save me looking - yup - lazy!
Fiar,
Hmmm... the Cow? Interesting...
I didn't think you'd get too thrilled by my suggestion. Probably made it because I am tempted to give that scraper technique a try.
I'll need Vic to explain how it's all automated though. As you said I wouldn't want to spend all day manually doing it. Oh Vic...
So you're the other guy who screwed up Technorati - and I thought I was the only one milking that cow. Tis a shame because it sure worked like a charm before they caught on.
Fiar email me as I have a suggestion for you. It's totally not above board but you may be interested.
Denise,
In general I want my homepage to rank for all the main keywords. You'll notice in the screenshots above how many different MMO terms take the visitor to my home page.
If I do a post on a specific topic like Hubpages or Adsense or Project Payday etc then I want those pages ranking for the term and not my home page. Ideally I want every single page to rank high in the serp's for at least one term. This does take a long time to achieve but is worth it as it increases the authority of your entire site and each individual page.
You will also gain PR on every page which gives you a lot more pages to use for linking elsewhere as well as the all important keyword authority.
If I was to start a blog on Adsense I can give it a boost by linking to it from my Adsense page. This will have a greater impact as that page has PR and more keyword Authority for the term than my homepage does. The page would also have better juice simply because it would only have that one outbound link in the post. A perfect relevant keyword anchored text link. The kind of link that is so hard to come by.
You can see how this blog can be used to start numerous other blogs just by linking out from my various pages. If you tried this just using a blogroll on your high PR homepage you would quickly dilute the juice and your homepage doesn't have the keyword authority for a wide variety of terms.
This is why it is so important to get deep links to all the pages on your site. Your keyword authority skyrockets for hundreds of terms that can be used to build a blogging empire - this is what a flagship blog is all about.
Hi, is there any other long term make money online methods other than writing articles? Thanks
Grizz,
Great explaination! You just knitted so many loose ends together.
I am so thick. It has only taken me two years to finally start to understand this stuff.
Terry, can't wait until you are ready to rock and roll with the forum.
Hey Grizz,
Good post, but couldn't help but notice a little "sales pitch" tone there. Please never sell...(more like sell out your readers which is what they are doing) we need you.
Have you looked at Vic's BANS sites idea? It looks solid but will come with an up front cost. And I'm as broke as they come. I'll borrow the money if I feel confident! Any thoughts?
Also in the tutorial you talk about keyword elite. (i downloaded their trial version and couldn't get it to work properly) Seeing as I want to invest in the BANS idea I would like to use somewhat smart keywords to start. You mentioned you could send a list of keywords to people that couldn't afford the product from the start. That deal still open? I would greatly appreciate the help.
Then I just have to convince my fiance to trust the internet guy's idea. That will be no small task. She finds anyone with a cartoon character of themself hard to take seriously!
Thanks Man.
Steve K
Cecilia,
Writing articles isn't a long term method for making money but rather a way of obtaining keyword anchored backlinks for your blog. You need these backlinks in order to get your blog indexed and ranked highly in Google for the niche you choose to pursue.
The blog itself will provide the income through adsense, affiliate sales, advertising revenues, lead generation or whatever form of monetization you choose.
The point is that you need traffic to your site first in order to make money. To get the right type of traffic you need a steady flow of visitors from Google's search engine. (Social traffic like stumbleupon etc doesn't spend money or click ads or buy advertising)
To get search traffic you need to rank on page 1 (position 1 ideally) for keywords that people are searching for. I rank on page one for lot's of make money online terms - everyday people type "make money online" into the Google search box. When they see the results listed by Google they start clicking the links to the websites or blogs listed on the first page. Many of them end up on my blog. Some read my content but about 60% just leave - some just close the tab but about 7% click on an ad hoping to find what they were looking for. I make money every time they click the ad.
To get your blog ranked highly for keywords that people search for you need Google to believe that you are the most relevant site on the internet for that particular keyword. To do this you need more people linking to you using that particular keyword in the link they place on their site which points to your site. In effect each of these links counts as a vote by others which tells Google they think you are relevant to that keyword and that they don't mind sending people to your site to find information for that term.
If you get more of these votes than anyone else then you will be ranked number one on Google's search results.
Getting these links are very hard and more so when you are just starting out.
One of the easiest ways to do this is by writing articles and posting them in article directories for other sites to use as content on their own site. If they follow the rules they will post your article on their blog and send you a backlink for your keyword which is included in the article. You just got 1 vote.
More articles - more votes.
This isn't the only way to get links. You can leave your link when commenting on do-follow blogs. In forum signatures. You can ask people to exchange links with you. You can also do things that aren't above board.
The point is that to make money you need backlinks in order to produce traffic. It's a lot of work and is the most important aspect of succeeding online.
Is there other ways to make money online? Yes. I am not the person to ask though. If any of my readers have had experience with work at home jobs, surveys, IFW's, paid writing etc please feel free to fill Cecilia in. Please don't spam me or her with links though - just the facts.
Denise,
Glad to hear it is all coming together.
Btw - Terry has been ready for ages - I am to blame - can't seem to get enough time to get my stuff together.
I'm trying...
Grizz, you often mention that we should try to put ads on our sites only at least a month or two after. Would it be able to throw them off if we backdated our content, if you know what I mean...
Ohhh crap Scraper Sites? LMAO!!!! Ohh well shoot to have some else talk about it and get noobs in trouble I will explain ina vlog post LMAO!!
I see your trollers keep growing Welcome to my world LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PS: I was thinking of having a troller this way with arro pointing to: makemoneyforbeginners.blogspot.com LMAO!!!!!!!
Now I have my daily trackbacks of bloggers writing about how I said this and how I said that and most of the stuff is a lie LMAO!! But my name is really well keyword stuffed with Blogger Unleashed LMAO!!
Sorry for the delay Griz, got sidetracked with a new directory site I just acquired...
That Yaro post wasn't all that great, but it did make me smile when I wrote the Yaro paragraph...
makemoney.thehonestway.com
The post is "TV Audio Video on Blogs" its still on the front page as I haven't reduced it to one post yet... mmm so much to be done so little time...
Steve,
Sorry if it sounded like a sales pitch - not to worry - can't sell a Blogger blog anyway. (Well maybe but it would be complicated)
Anyway - I am not interested in selling anything - this is my retirement savings plan.
I am a bans noob just like the rest of you. Vic will be holding my hand all the way. If Vic says they are the bomb then that's good enough for me.
I am more than happy to run lists for people using keyword elite - just send me your main keyword (email using KE List in subject)
Be warned that I have about 30 different projects I'm helping folks with at present and the response time will be slow. The program sucks up my bandwidth and can take some time to generate a list so I have been running it at night. Slow but what can I do.
I take it you haven't let her see Vic's Videos then? LOL.
YC,
No - won't work. It's not really an age thing. It's a ranking thing. If you are getting decent ranking then monetize. If you are in the netherworld don't - not like anyone would be clicking ads anyway.
You want the site as legit as possible - lots of links, lots of good content, lots of long tails - this will build your trust - no ads even more trust.
I have now decided that I don't monetize until I hit page one - why bother, as I said - you aren't going to get any clicks until you hit the first page anyway. (Ok you might get a few but you will probably be smart priced anyway)
Get ranking and traffic first - worry about the money second.
Grizz,
I just sent you an email about the forum. Please feel free to pass it along to Terry. I am going to be out of the loop for the next week + and I don't want to miss the info if you get things rolling.
Thanks,
-D
Vic...
I knew you would take the bait! My Man!
Keep your stinkin' trolls over there! LOL.
Hey - god or bad - it's all publicity. You'll be sippin' tea with Chow in no time. hehe.
Thanks Terry,
I'll sneak over shortly.
(no I haven't got to the forum yet!)
How did you put it...
"mmm so much to be done so little time..."
Dennis,
We're straight. Enjoy the trip.
Thanks Grizz,
Unfortunately I would have more fun sitting at home poking myself in the eye than going on this trip. I am just mad the company is using their work day to interrupt my blogging to MMO. LOL Jeez, I hope they don't have a keylogger program.
Grizz, thanks for the reply. I found that out to be true by my own experience last month. Had a blog that ranked on the first page for many keywords within a niche for a month and it was like an adsense avalanche. I had clicks of $1 or more easily in that position. But it got sent to the sandbox in a way as it only showed up in lower ranked pages overnight - new domain and got 50k hits in the first month. shit. I still got some clicks after that but they were 10c or less so I had to remove the adsense and wait for the site to age as I maintain it.
I didn't think through my question properly. What if I had a new site like the one above, new, less than a month old domain, got it to rank high fast and I add adsense to it? (it's usually because the niche could be underserved or the other sites on the first page are not that clued in on SEO, I think)
This could be similar to what you do with your adhoc sites for a quick rinse before a 'fad' dies out I suppose, except mine is a long term site.
Hi,
I have an old blog of PR2 which i used to sell jewelry.
Should i delete all my previous post, anyway im not selling it anymore?
Thanks
I think a big point you make here is this: the KW phrase make money online get almost zipoo search, except for the nutbars who are trying to rank for that phrase. I made the stupid mistake of using an MMO phrase for my blog a few years back. Thanks the gods that I got KW elite. I have found a whack of other KW phrases to rank for. Good thing I happened across vic and your blog, this MMO whole scene has just been pissing me off for oh I dont know the past 6 months or so. I have a few other sites in some obscure niches that do much better and earn much better than alot of what I see on the MMO niche blogs with alot less work to be quite honest. I just wish people would open their eyes and ears and start doing research its quite unreal how easy it really is to start making money. I frikken peeves me off all the BS floating around about how to make money money online. It's like anything else find a product that sells find the people that are buying it and sell it to them. this is the way business works. No secret there. I personally dont subscribe to vics methods but thats me and not what I want to do. His blog is chock full of help as is yours (sorry for lurking so long)Ive neoticed the alexa trend as well ans was wondering what was up with that. I prefer to think that the MMO phase is dying out
YC,
I understand now. In a case where you do get good ranking right from the get go - usually because there is little competition - then absolutely milk it while it's hot. What you did was perfect - monitor the clicks and if the pricing drops (as you noted) remove the adsense and nurture it back to the front page of the serp's.
As you said this is exactly what I do with short term hit and run blogs. Btw - I never discard them when the run is over - I just remove the monetization and keep them alive with a post from time to time in order to age them and build some authority. They become part of the link farm for later use or can be re-fitted for similar keywords later if a new niche comes along.
In any event if you find yourself with a top ranking site then there is no problem monetizing it early. I only suggest not doing this if the new blog isn't getting traffic and has poor ranking.
Cecilia,
Never delete posts - Google frowns on this as this is something spammers do a lot.
If the site is PR 2 you don't want to do anything to lose it.
Simply find a new niche - re-write the old posts (edit them for the new keywords) and begin posting fresh content on the new topic of choice.
What you have is an aged, indexed site with some trust built up with Google. This is a good thing and will help jump start the blog in a new direction if you wish.
Shane,
What can I add to that. You are dead on. This niche is hugely over saturated, has little traffic compared to most niches and consists of hundreds of thousands of similar blogs all saying the same thing (mostly wrong) and trying to sell the same stuff to the same bloggers.
Little wonder bloggers don't make money.
Well said Shane and nice to have you come out of the shadows. :-)
What a fascinating post! Really explodes a few myths. I submitted it to yearblook.com. Yearblook is a competition to find the best blog posts, and they print the winners in a book. Good luck!
Do they pay you for printing your post?
If not, then I hate to be a party pooper but on minimal info, Yearblook sounds like a scam to take good posts and use them as content for a book they might well sell...
Royalties, on the other hand, are always welcome from such a thing.
Hey Grizz,
No I certainly don't show her his videos...but now that he's live i don't want to miss anything so she might hear an f bomb here and there. Oh well
Anyway where is your email? I can't find it on here.
If I'm looking to do BANS sites what general keyword should I start with. Any suggestions?
Thanks man!
Steve K
Grizz:
It's funny that I've been reading and dabbling in this stuff for a couple of months now, and it seems like only at this point do I actually have some idea of where to go. Your help has been amazing.
I've been reading Court's site too (at your suggestion - thanks a ton for that) and saw they prefer to set up websites to host their blogs. I haven't ever heard much about that from you and was wondering what you thought about it.
The biggest question I have is does it make a difference for people clicking if they can see something like makemoney.com versus makemoney.blogspot.com? Is it enough of a difference to go through the extra step of setting up a web site? What is your preference.
Again, appreciate all your help, and keep up the good work!
@ C Small
The argument for buying a domain is primarily that it is a property you own, and can subsequently sell, if you want. Almost like we're back on topic here. Heh.
It's not that expensive, nor is it that much of a hassle to buy a domain and set up hosting/wordpress, but it is an additional requirement.
When you set up a blogspot blog, it's instant. Within minutes your ready to start posting.
However, you don't own anything. And your site exists at Blogger's discretion. You may notice comments about being "flagged" for review. This won't happen on self-hosted sites.
One of the arguments Grizz makes is that if you do things right, you will never want to sell anything, nor do you need to worry Re: "Blogger's discretion." Ultimately you will pass the visual inspection test.
Another plus is that Blogspot templates have are fairly well optimized for SEO right off the bat, whereas most Wordpress themes will require some tweaking/plugins to be optimized.
There's no right or wrong answer here. It's a matter of preference, mostly. Just like I prefer to own a home rather than rent, I prefer to own domains rather than "rent" them from Blogger.com
One additional benefit of owning a domain is greater flexibility and customizability.
I don't want to sound like I'm selling one point of view over another, but I am biased towards self-hosting, but that's just my experience and preference.
Another key point here is that one of the premises of this site is being able to follow the steps Grizz has laid out, and start making money without ever spending anything. So, I'm sure Grizz can't help but to advocate free Blogger site. It's kind of in the mission statement.
Like I said, there's no wrong answer. Neither option is inherently better from the perspective of ranking IF you make the necessary alterations to a hosted site.
The real question might just be: Do you want to own or rent?
@Grizz
I sent you an email about that. Subject line :Not completely above board?
Actually, Grizz, I sold a blogger blog. :) Well, I was actually hosting the blog on blogger, but used a top level domain....1000pushups.com. But it's a blogger blog! :)
Hey Griz
I tried to leave a comment here yesterday but for some reasons it wouldn't let me. Aw shucks.
As usual I'm late for the party and have no idea on what the talk about forums here is in your comments section. Would you mind to enlighten me please.
You might also like to see yet another post on the whole Vic story and I'm sure it isn't the last either. Funny thing is, the author of the post slams Vic for doing something he does not too much later himself.
Somebody please tell me what the heck is going on in these people's minds.
Anyway, wanted to tell you what a great post this was (as usual) and that I'm happy for you to finally have found a great following of very smart people (and not sheep like some might put it).
Anyway, hope to catch up soon with you on skype for a little chat when you got a minute.
Here is that link: http://www.garryconn.com/flipping-blog-scams-mmo-niche-is-full-of-jerks.php
Monika :)
Grizz, I was doing some keyword searching yeaterday and fopund a keyword string I had done and it ended up #1 on Google and yours was #4 on the first page. It blew me away. Totally by accident and it is on a blog that monetizes nothing. :-( Not trying to brag, just making an observation that yes we can rank by accident.
My real question is; On Vics live chat it was brought up not to disclose our adsense sites. How do we not disclose them when trying to get backlinks? I have used the do-follow blogs for the reason of getting backlinks.
Should I build my own blog farm and get them ranked for authority and then use them for links to my adsense niches? Sounds like a long round about way to go about it.
Monika, I think if Garry bothered to see what Vic has done to help the rest of us and go beyond his rough language, he would know he was in the wrong. At the moment, he cannot get past the 'niceness' that people like Caroline Middlebrook have even though their actions betray their intentions, intentionally or not.
He then proceeded to reveal personal conversations he had with John Cow for everyone to see, and hurled insults and vulgarities at him as well. Pot calling the kettle black. He might have his own reasons to do that to Cow, so what makes him any better than Vic who also has his own reasons for criticising Marc and Caroline?
At the end of the day, it's very simple, if these people who criticise Vic now can do a fraction of what he does - and that includes a lot of one on one help - then perhaps they might have more credibility. At the moment, they're just pests who believe too much in the saying that any publicity is good publicity.
@ Fiar
Thanks for the info. Although very comprehensive, I think it slightly missed the point of my question. I understand the argument regarding selling your site later and having that motivate using a domain name. But what I was more curious about was click rates on blogspot sites vs. regular sites.
What I mean is, has anyone seen less clicks on a site because it has a blogspot address vs a regular dot com address? Or is there really no difference?
By the way, I love the comments here. It's almost like a little classroom!
ba-a-a-a-a LMAO!!!
Hi Monika, the forum talk is about Griz making some posts that he would not want to be shown publicly on his blog.
I'm renting him a small corner of my forum to do that (he hasn't seen the bill yet hahaha!). Ok, I jest.
Its a hidden section of the forum that the SE bots don't look at and no one else can see unless certain steps are followed. Once everything's ready, it will be a register-by-email invite only.
You're still a mod there, so you'll see it when you next log in - once Griz posts his stuff.
Hi Griz,
How r u man.........just dropped in to know about the progress of the forum........my Indian Premier League Blog has setteled in the Second page for the main keyword and i'm workin to take it to the first page.....i'm getting traffic but still struggling to make gud adsense revenue....
Dennis,
Tnx for ur sugesstions on adsense man.....they are working........but i'm not still statisfied with the earnings..........still experimenting for the better ones.....
@ C Small, Yes I did understand that part of the question. Sorry if I was unclear in my response.
I don't think that there is any significant difference in clickthrough or credibility rate with domain vs. blogspot.
In fact, I think *most* search engine users don't even look at the part that shows the URL of the site.
They look at the title and the excerpt.
I invite anyone to add their thoughts, or refute if I seem off base.
C small & Fiar,
No difference in my experience. I have blogs on different platforms within the same niche and there is no significant difference due to that. The only thing that matters is SERPS placement. The lower a site is positioned, obviously less traffic, less clicks. And the clicks are worth less.
Grizz,
Thanks for visiting my blog and leaving your comment. Greatly appreciated.
Denise
@ Everyone
Hi, I've just sent out a response to all your emails and the forum is open for business.
If anyone that emailed me didn't get a response, please email me again, as my inbox looked like a spammer's stag night party guestlist this morning and it took me a good while going through them all!
I look forward to seeing you all on the Dark Side... hehehe
Terry
Sorry for the absence folks - I had to get the forum up and a few other housekeeping chores.
Isobel,
I appreciate your intentions with Yearbook.com although Terry is right. If this site doesn't get the permission of the Author's to republish material then there could be problems - especially if they intend to make money from it.
Your heart was in the right place however and I do appreciate that. Thanks.
Steve,
If you haven't found it my email is below in the "Need Help" section.
I will refrain from suggesting keywords in public - no point in having everyone target the same ones.
I am not an ebay expert but I assume they must display the most popular items in some way. I suggest you visit Frank at Optempo.com as he is far more knowledgeable than me on this subject.
C. Small,
Everything Fiar said is spot on.
My intention with this blog is to show beginners how you can make a legitimate income online for free. I use Blogger to do this.
Blogger has many advantages for what I do but everything can be done with a self hosted blog as well - it's a bit more work and requires a little more knowledge than Blogger but is well worth learning.
If you want to build a social site then only use self hosted.
If you want to test a niche then use blogger - zero cost. If the niche pans out you can create a nice fancy wordpress blog or simply proceed with the blogger blog.
I do find blogger does a great job with Adsense - because it is inherently ugly you tend to get a better click rate from people who perceive it to be of little value based on it's look. They see the ad that is on topic and choose it instead of reading the blog.
The nice thing is you won't be penalized by adsense for purposely creating a blog designed to enhance clicks - Google owns blogger and it's their fault people click out and is not something I have done.
If you want readers then design a nice looking site with wordpress. If you want to make money then the goal is click outs - not readers and an "Ugly" site is one of the secrets to achieving this - on blogger or wordpress.
As for search traffic - they don't know the difference in URL's and will click the top ranking blog first and work their way down the list.
If they do notice blogspot.com and know what it is then they are a fellow blogger and you don't want them anyway - they are just readers. (Assuming you are trying to make money.)
If you are after social traffic then blogspot.com in the index will not help you and stick to your own domain.
Ultimately your goal will decide which platform to use. Both can be equally successful if used correctly.
Jack,
There are ways to sell it as you mentioned but not something I would ever discuss in public. :-)
Monika,
Thanks and I will get a hold of you about the forum or talk to Terry.
The blog sales issue has certainly got out of hand in a hurry. I did read Conn's post and John Cow's as well. Have also seen a dozen other sites deal with the subject too.
It was a slow week in the MMO niche I guess and this gave everyone something to yak about. lol
Talk soon
Denise,
I talk about this in the forum which I think you are part of. Read more there.
For now let's just say it is never a good thing to let others know if you have a good paying keyword. The fact that most people who see your do follow links are clueless about making money makes this less of an issue.
However you do want to watch out for people like me - I know what most of your sites are because you have left a trail. And yes I always check out new keywords just in case someone comes up with a winner. Don't worry - I would never compete with my readers but I have found quite a few other niches because of the links people have left all over the place - people I don't know and they are fair game in my book.
This is what Vic is getting at - I don't ever advertise my money sites.
YC,
Lot's of grandstanding by the parties involved. Stir up the pot - pull in readers. Social blogging 101. Garry has decided to be a social blogger now and has adopted the habits.
Whether you like Vic's tactics or not - he is very effective at getting the word out. Good thing he has thick skin. He has certainly changed the way a lot of people perceive the MMO niche and that is a good thing.
Terry,
A bill.... ooops.
Aravind,
The forum is now live.
If the main blog doesn't an out for adsense then think of funneling traffic to a site that has better monetization. Don't give up just yet though. Keep experimenting.
Everyone,
I'm going off the air early today - I'll have to deal with all new emails and sign-ups tomorrow (my time) - that's in case you're wonderin...
Grizzly,
Absolutely awesome article.
My secret plan, to destroy my SEO was almost complete. It was so secret that I did not even know about it. Your Info is invaluable, I know you are busy, but you will be getting even more traffic for content consumption.
Regards,
Dirkrcs
Hi, my site gets on the 1st or 2nd page in google but still no traffic. May i know why? Very puzzled here. Thanks
Hi Griz,
It's great that the forum is live..........how to use it.........any terms and conditions.....
Hi Griz,
Took me a long time but I am caught up on your blog's latest comment section marathon. *Whew*
It hailed then snowed here in Lotusland (a.k.a. Vancouver) this evening.
Snow in April!
Any tears for me, Griz? lol
I have been keeping busy with my niche efforts; I have one movie blog that is my adsense workhorse right now. I totally forgot about the smart pricing thing though so its time to maybe pull adsense off afew of my other blogs with little / no conversion. The funny thing about my movie blog is that it is getting its click throughs from ... Yahoo! Thanks to statcounter, I found out that Yahoo loves my Blogger blog and went and ranked me number one on a really neat keyword and I had no clue since as you say we are aiming our harpoons at the Google whale, so to speak.
I also noticed that ranking above an official movie site is do-able if they don't do their SEO homework ! ;)
I am almost at the point of biting the SEO bullet and putting out the cash for SEO Elite and Keyword Elite; I think they are still available at 50% off if you register for the free versions of Article submitter or Directory submitter (same owner - Brad Callen). Thought all of your regular readers should know about that and maybe save a few bucks
I got the forum email and plan on signing up very soon; once I get there Griz I want to see what you think of this new 'Kahuna' product that is being touted as better than LV.
Now I just need to figure out a way to sneak SEO software onto our Wedding blog's gift registry ...
-Stephen-
Cecilia,
It can depend on what the search term is that you are ranking for. The higher the search volume for that term, the further back you can be and still get traffic for it.
You might be ranking for a low volume search term, and thus, people don't click through past the first few results.
@ Aravind and anyone else having trouble figuring out the forum:
Simply follow the link I gave you on the email and go to the site. Click the register tab near the top of the page.
Registration is pretty straightforward so I won't go thru that. Once you're registered you'll get a verification email which you have to respond to (so use a real email address when you sign up). Once you verify your email address, you can sign in to the forum with your username and password.
Don't worry too much about terms and conditions, just apply common sense please!
Write a post in the new introductions section like I said on the email to introduce yourself so I'll know that you're there. I will then manually give you permission to view the hidden forum, then respond to your intro post with a welcome message.
Once you have that, you may read and post in the hidden part of the forum.
Hope that clears things up!
Terry
@ Grizz/Terry.
What's this I hear about a forum and how does one get in? :)
Hey Grizz if u ever plan on selling this blog or any of your other niches, i just might be very interested :D
Great stuff man, i appreciate what your doing! Kudos!!!
lol, as of now he is ranked #9 in the US datacenter for that term..
Good post GrizZ!
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